ALBERT ROSENTHAL (ALTER ROGALL) WITH PARENTS ABRAHAM (ABRAM) AND SARAH (SORE), SISTERS LEAH (LEYE) AND ROSE (ROCHEL), AND NEPHEW HARRY (HERSCH) - IMMIGRATION - DECEMBER 15, 1902

DOCUMENTS:
1. rosenthal-immigration-1902-12-15-abraham.png (see line 27)
2. rosenthal-immigration-1902-12-15-sarah-etc.png (see lines 18-26)
3. rosenthal-immigration-1902-german-passenger-list.jpg (see the 12th line from the top for Abraham, and the 26th line for Sarah, followed by the children)
4. rosenthal-sarah-immigration-detention-1902.jpg (see line 21)

CONTENTS OF THE PAGE BELOW:

• A. WHAT THESE DOCUMENTS TELL US, AND THE QUESTIONS THEY RAISE
• B. NOTES ABOUT THE FIRST AND SECOND DOCUMENTS (THE ENGLISH PASSENGER MANIFEST)
• C. NOTES ABOUT THE THIRD DOCUMENT (THE GERMAN DEPARTURE LIST)
• D. NOTES ABOUT THE FOURTH DOCUMENT (PASSENGERS DETAINED AT ELLIS ISLAND)
• E. WHAT DID ABRAHAM AND/OR SARAH LATER TELL CENSUS TAKERS ABOUT WHAT YEAR THEY HAD IMMIGRATED?
• F. HOW DID WE FIND THESE DOCUMENTS, AND HOW DO WE KNOW THEY'RE FOR THE RIGHT FAMILY?
• G. INTERESTING BACKGROUND INFORMATION

A. WHAT THESE DOCUMENTS TELL US, AND THE QUESTIONS THEY RAISE

These three documents from 1902 record the immigration of Albert Rosenthal (Alter Rogall) [Harold's father], Albert's parents Abraham (Abram) and Sarah (Sore), Albert's sisters Leah (Leye) and Rose (Rochel), and his nephew Harry (Hersch). They travelled on the steamship "Patricia," which left Hamburg, Germany on November 28 or 29, 1902 and arrived at Ellis Island in New York City on December 15.

These documents tell us a lot:

• They show that the family's surname was Rogall and was not changed to Rosenthal by the authorities at Ellis Island. The family must have changed it themselves, sometime after their arrival in 1902 but before 1905, when the census records them as "Rosenthal". (Many Americans believe their family's name was changed at Ellis Island, but it seems this belief is usually incorrect.)
• These documents appear to support the moving story that many family members have heard: that Abraham and Sarah, when emigrating with their children, rescued their young married daughter Leah (Albert's older sister) from an abusive marriage and brought her to America with them by pretending that she was unmarried and that her son (their grandson) was one of their own children. In the passenger manifest, Leye (Leah) is listed as Sore's (Sarah's) oldest child, age 20, unmarried; and Hersch (Harry) is listed as Sarah's youngest child, age 5. Presumably Hersch is in fact Leah's son [Harry Rosenthal].

But these documents also raise some mysterious questions:

• Why was Abraham listed separately from his family, as though he was travelling alone, and why did his wife tell the authorities that she and her children were joining her husband "Josef Rogall" in New York (while Abraham separately said he was joining his brother Josef Rogall)? (A Joseph Rogall did indeed come to claim Sarah and the children from detention at Ellis Island.)
• Why were there four additional children travelling with Sarah (Feine, Dwoire, Schloime, and Sore), who she claimed were her own -- and who were they? As far as we know, Abraham and Sarah only had six children: three born in Poland (Leah, Rose, and Albert) and three born in the U.S. (Ida, Morris, and Samuel/Paddy). These four other children do not appear in the census record for the family two-and-a-half years later (1905).
  UPDATE, June 2017: A story related by Abraham and Sarah's granddaughter in a 2005 family-history video provides a partial answer:

  "He took not only the three children, and wife, but friends said, 'Oh, Avram Pesach, I can't come in, I don't have anyone to back me, can we come in as your children?' They were friends of his children. And he took them [...] Zelda Rosen and her two children -- they came in as Avram Pesach's children."

• Why did Abraham answer "no" when asked if he'd ever been in the United States before? (I believe he had previously come to the U.S. in 1896.)
• Why was Abraham's place of residence given as Warsaw, while the rest of the family's was given as Prasnys?

I wonder if a possible explanation for some of this could be as follows (this is just a theory!):

Perhaps Abraham had a brother named Josef, and each of the two brothers immigrated initially without their families, saving up money in order to bring their families over. Perhaps at some point Abraham returned to Poland while Josef remained in New York. Perhaps Josef's wife died, so Abraham and Sarah took care of Josef's children as well as their own. Perhaps Abraham and Sarah did not have enough money with them to be confident of being admitted to the United States along with all the children. If so, perhaps it seemed safer to claim they were Josef's wife and children; as a New York resident, Josef could come and claim an "unaccompanied" wife and children from Ellis Island.

B. NOTES ABOUT THE FIRST AND SECOND DOCUMENTS (THE ENGLISH PASSENGER MANIFEST)

The first two documents are pages from the English-language passenger manifest. Such manifests were prepared by clerks for the shipping company, before departure; the companies were required to prepare these manifests and hand them over to the U.S. immigration authorities at Ellis Island, who kept them (and sometimes annotated them).

• Here's how I think the people listed in the passenger manifest correspond to Albert Rosenthal [Harold's father] and his family:
  • Abram Rogall, age 40 = Abraham Rosenthal [Harold's grandfather]
  • Sore Rogall, age 40 = Sarah Rosenthal [Harold's grandmother]
  • Leye Rogall, age 20 = Leah Rosenthal [Harold's aunt]
  • Rochel Rogall, age 17 = Rose Rosenthal [Harold's aunt]
  • Feine Rogall, age 19 = ?? (perhaps actually a niece?)
  • Dwoire Rogall, age 10 = ?? (perhaps actually a niece?)
  • Schloime Rogall, age 9 = ?? (perhaps actually a nephew?)
  • Sore Rogall, age 8 = ?? (perhaps actually a niece?)
  • Alter Rogall, age 7 = Albert Rosenthal [Harold's father]
  • Hersch Rogall, age 5 = Harry Rosenthal, Leah's son [Harold's cousin]
• I think the age recorded for Albert (Alter) in the shipping manifest (age 7) was a mistake. Albert was born in 1890 according to his naturalization documents, so in December 1902 we'd expect him to be 12.
• Albert's grandson confirms that "Alter" was what family members such as Albert's wife Naomi called Albert. He remembers hearing that when Albert was born he was small or sickly so his parents named him Alter, meaning old man, hoping he would live to be old.
• Abraham is listed on an earlier page of the passenger manifest than Sarah and the children; there are about 20 passengers listed in between them. Abraham (Abram) is fourth from the bottom of page 45, and Sarah is eighteenth on page 47. (But page 46 only contains an affidavit of the ship's officer and surgeon that they have examined the 30 passengers listed in the preceding pages).
• Here's a copy of the (modern) transcription copied from ancestry.ca
  (Note: This ship's manifest has been transcribed by more than one microfilming/indexing project, and the similar list of names in the German-language Hamburg departure list has also been transcribed. The different transcribers interpreted some of the handwritten names differently, so next to the transcription below that I copied from the Ellis Island site, I've added information in square brackets about alternate transcriptions found for each name.)

  TRANSCRIPTION FOR ABRAHAM ROSENTHAL (LISTED SEPARATELY FROM THE REST OF THE FAMILY):
  
      First Name :   Abram
      Last Name :   Ragall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Age at Arrival :   40y
      Gender :   Male
      Marital Status :   Married
  
  TRANSCRIPTION FOR SARAH ROSENTHAL AND OTHER FAMILY MEMBERS:
  
      First Name :   Sore
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Last Place of Residence :   Danish
      Age at Arrival :   40y
      Gender :   Female
      Marital Status :   Married
  
      First Name :   Leye [another transcriptions say "Loge"]
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Last Place of Residence :   Danish
      Age at Arrival :   20y
      Gender :   Female
      Marital Status :   Single
  
      First Name :   Rachel [two other transcriptions say "Rochel"]
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Last Place of Residence :   Danish
      Age at Arrival :   17y
      Gender :   Female
      Marital Status :   Single
  
      First Name :   Feure [I believe this actually says "Feine": another 
      transcription says "Feine" and yet another transcription says "Jeine"; 
      in the separate German passenger list, this name is transcribed as Feine.]
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Last Place of Residence :   Danish
      Age at Arrival :   19y
      Gender :   Female
      Marital Status :   Single
  
      First Name :   Irvane [I believe this actually says "Dwoire": 
      another transcription says "Dwoire" and yet another transcription 
      says "Frosine"; in the separate German passenger list, this name 
      is transcribed as Dwoire. Dwoire may be an alternate spelling for 
      Dvoire which appears to be a Yiddish version of the Hebrew name Deborah.],
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Age at Arrival :   10y
      Gender :   Female
      Marital Status :   Single
  
      First Name :   Schlome [I believe this actually says "Schloime": another 
      transcription says "Schloime" and yet another transcription says "Seplonime"; 
      in the separate German passenger list, this name is transcribed as Schloime]
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Age at Arrival :   9y
      Gender :   Male
      Marital Status :   Single
  
      First Name :   Sore [another transcription says "Jore"; in the separate 
      German passenger list, this name is transcribed as Sore]
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Age at Arrival :   8y
      Gender :   Female
  
      First Name :   Alfer [I believe this actually says " "Alter": another 
      transcription says "Alter" and yet another transcription says "Alber"; 
      in the separate German passenger list I found, this name is transcribed 
      as Alter]
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Age at Arrival :   7y
      Gender :   Male
      Marital Status :   Single
  
      First Name :   Hersch
      Last Name :   Rogall
      Nationality :   Russia, Russian
      Age at Arrival :   5y
      Gender :   Male
      Marital Status :   Single
  

• The "Last Residence" for Abraham is hard to read; for Sore and the rest of the family, it's Prasynys.
• The relative in New York listed next to both Abraham and Sarah is Josef (or Jossef) Rogall; he's listed as Abraham's brother and Sarah's husband. Josef's street name is hard to decipher -- it might be "Division" and the number might be 246? This information is given twice, once next to the entry for Abraham and once next to the entry for Sarah and their children. After the street name, does it say "St."? Or "Av"? Google Maps shows there is now a Division Street on the Lower East Side (it's close to Ludlow Street, and in the 1915 census Abraham and Sarah's address is 16 Ludlow). But Division is too short to have a # 246 (at least it is now).
• There is an x to the left of Sarah's name and the name of each child. According to: http://www.jewishgen.org/infofiles/manifests/ "The letters "X," "D," and the word "Held" can mean either that the immigrant went to temporary detention or had a Special Inquiry hearing."
• The (modern) transcription of the surname for Sarah is Rogall, and that's what the handwriting appears to say. For Abram, the (modern) transcription of the surname is Ragall; but looking at the handwriting, I think the second letter looks more like an "o" than an "a" -- though it's hard to say -- there's a circle plus a little line. And in the two places where the relative they are joining is mentioned, (Josef or Jossef Rogal), there's the same circle plus a little line (o? a? oi?)
• For column 15, "Whether ever before in the United States, and if so, when and where" the answer is "no" for both Abraham and Sarah. In each case, near the top of the page it says "no" for the first passenger, and below that there is a mark seeming to indicate "same as above" for all the other passengers.
• The ship's manifest shows it left Hamburg on Nov. 28, 1902 and arrived in New York on Dec. 15. The affidavits in the manifest (by the ship's officer and surgeon) are from Nov. 28, 1902.

C. NOTES ABOUT THE THIRD DOCUMENT (THE GERMAN DEPARTURE LIST)

The third document is the German-language departure list. Many people from all over Europe emigrated from Hamburg, and the lists were preserved by the port of Hamburg.

• This list, in German, is a departure list for the port of Hamburg.
• Since the children are listed in exactly the same order as in the English document (which isn't quite birth order), and with exactly the same ages, perhaps the two documents were created at once? Or, perhaps the English document was prepared afterwards, based on the German one? The one difference is that in the German document, the last two children were both listed as being named Alter; whereas in the English list, the last child's name as Hersch. Perhaps the person copying the English list from the German list realized that the repetition of the same name for two children must be a mistake and followed up to get the correct name? Or on the other hand, perhaps the English document was written first, and the person who copied from it to create the German document made a mistake in repeating "Alter"?
• Abraham's place of residence is "Warschau," the German word for Warsaw. For Sore and the rest of the family, the place of residence is Prasnys.
• The (modern) transcription gives Abraham's occupation as "Schneider, Geselle." This appears to mean "Tailor, Assistant."
• Abraham is listed in the 1896 manifest as a shoemaker; but he is listed in the 1902 ship's manifest as a tailor. In the 1905 census he is the proprietor of a restaurant; in the 1910 census he is a peddler; in the 1920 census he has his own store; and in the 1925 census he is a baker.
• Here's a copy of the (modern) transcription copied from ancestry.ca

  TRANSCRIPTION FOR ABRAHAM (LISTED SEPARATELY FROM THE OTHERS):
  
  Hamburger Passagierlisten, 1850-1934 Hamburg Passenger Lists, 1850-1934
  Name:    Abram Rogall
  Departure Date:  29 Nov 1902
  Birth Date:      abt 1862
  Age:     40
  Gender:  männlich (Male)
  Marital Status:  verheiratet (Married)
  Residence:       Warschau (Warszawa)
  Ethnicity/Nationality:   Russland (Russian)
  Occupation:      Schneider, Geselle
  
  TRANSCRIPTION FOR SARAH AND THE REST OF THE FAMILY:
  
  Hamburger Passagierlisten, 1850-1934 Hamburg Passenger Lists, 1850-1934
  Name:    Sore Rogall
  Departure Date:  29 Nov 1902
  Birth Date:      abt 1862
  Age:     40
  Gender:  weiblich (Female)
  Relationship:    Mutter (Mother)
  Residence:       Prasnys
  Ethnicity/Nationality:   Russland (Russian)
         
  Ship Name:       Patricia
  Shipping line:   Hamburg-Amerika Linie (Hamburg-Amerikanische Packetfahrt-Actien-Gesellschaft)
  Shipping Clerk:  Hamburg-Amerika Linie (Hamburg-Amerikanische Packetfahrt-Actien-Gesellschaft)
  Ship Type:       Dampfschiff
  Accommodation:   Zwischendeck
  Ship Flag:       Deutschland
  Port of Departure:       Hamburg
  Port of Arrival:         Plymouth; Boulogne; New York
         
  Volume:  373-7 I, VIII A 1 Band 137
  Household Members:     
  Name     Age
  Sore Rogall      40
  Leye Rogall      20
  Rochel Rogall    17
  Feine Rogall     19
  Dwoire Rogall    10
  Schloime Rogall  9
  Sore Rogall      8
  Alter Rogall     7
  Alter Rogall     5
  
  Name:    Leye Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1882
  Age:     20
  Gender:  weiblich (Female)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Rochel Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1885
  Age:     17
  Gender:  weiblich (Female)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Feine Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1883
  Age:     19
  Gender:  weiblich (Female)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Dwoire Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1892
  Age:     10
  Gender:  weiblich (Female)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Schloime Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1893
  Age:     9
  Gender:  männlich (Male)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Sore Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1894
  Age:     8
  Gender:  weiblich (Female)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Alter Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1895
  Age:     7
  Gender:  männlich (Male)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  Name:    Alter Rogall
  Birth Date:      abt 1897
  Age:     5
  Gender:  männlich (Male)
  Relationship:    Kind (Child)
  
  

D. NOTES ABOUT THE FOURTH DOCUMENT (PASSENGERS DETAINED AT ELLIS ISLAND)

The fourth document is from Ellis Island. For each ship that arrived, a list was prepared of passengers who were detained at Ellis Island; this document shows that Sarah Rosenthal (Sore Rogall) and her children were detained temporarily.

• This is a page from the "Record of Detained Alien Passengers" for the ship Patricia which arrived in New York from Hamburg, Dec. 15, 1902.
• Line 21 appears to me to read as follows:

  Name: Rogall Serr + 9 ch
  Group: 47
  Number: 18/26
  Number of aliens: 10
  Cause of Detention: To Husb.
  Disposition: Husb. Joseph  63 Stanton St. NY
  Discharged:
     By Inspector: Behlert
     Date: 12/16
     Time: 11:00
  Meals:
     Breakfast: 10
     Dinner: 10
     Supper: 10
  

• This record seems to show that Sarah was married to Joseph and had to wait for him to come pick her and her children up, which he did the day after they arrived. However as discussed above, it seems likely that although Sarah told the authorities Joseph was her husband, in fact he was her brother-in-law.
• The address for Joseph is 63 Staunton Street (see this address today in Google Maps); presumably he provided this address when he came to collect the family -- it is different from the one that Abraham and Sarah each gave for Joseph Rogall in the passenger manifest (an address on Division). Maybe Joseph had recently moved? (which would make sense if he were living alone and then found a larger place to accommodate the whole family).
• This says Sarah was detained with 9 children, but only 8 children were listed in the manifest -- perhaps a clerical error?
• Ellis Island kept track of the number of meals served to detainees and charged the cost to the shipping company in question.

E. WHAT DID ABRAHAM AND/OR SARAH LATER TELL CENSUS TAKERS ABOUT WHAT YEAR THEY HAD IMMIGRATED?

• In the 1905 census, number of years in the U.S. is 14 for Abraham and Sarah, and it's 2 for Albert and Rose.
• In the 1910 census, year of immigration to the U.S. is 1903 for Abraham, Sarah, Albert, and Rose.
• In the 1915 census, number of years in the U.S. is 20 for Abraham, and it's 13 for Sarah, Leah, Rachel, and Alter.
• In the 1920 census, year of immigration to the U.S. is 1895 for Abraham, and it's 1903 for Sarah and Rose.
• In the 1925 census, number of years in the U.S. is 25 for Abraham and Sarah, and it's 20 for Rose.
• In the 1930 census, year of immigration to the U.S. is 1902 for Abraham, Sarah, and Rose.

F. HOW DID WE FIND THESE DOCUMENTS, AND HOW DO WE KNOW THEY'RE FOR THE RIGHT FAMILY?

Initially I had not been able to find the family by searching in the Ellis Island database for their names, using "Rosenthal", "Ruggill" (which I'd been told was their original name), a "wildcard" search for "r*g*l", etc. But once photocopies of Albert Rosenthal's naturalization papers arrived in the mail from Minnesota, I had additional information: In applying for citizenship, Albert stated that he arrived on a ship named "Patricia," from Hamburg, in November or December 1902. This made it possible to locate the ship's manifest (since one of the dates when the Patricia arrived in New York was Dec. 15, 1902) and to browse through an alphabetical list of passengers whose surname began with R, which led to a family named "Rogall," which is pretty similar to "Ruggill."

How can we be certain this is the right family? Because the place name provided by for Sarah (Sore) as her place of last residence appears to be "Prasnys," which is very similar to the place name Albert provided in his application for citizenship, "Prashnish." These both appear to be variant spellings for the Polish town "Przasnysz". (For each resident, the shipping clerk seems to have written the province, in smaller letters, above the town. For Sarah it's hard to read the word written as province -- a transcriber interpreted it as "Danish," but according to the JewishGen website, the town of Przasnysz was in the district of Przasnysz, in the province of Plock -- so who knows what this says?.)

G. INTERESTING BACKGROUND INFORMATION

• Information about the ship "Patricia" from the Ellis Island website:

  "Built by A/G Vulcan Shipyard, Stettin, Germany, 1899. 13,023 gross tons; 585 (bp) feet long; 62 feet wide. Steam Quadruple Expansion engines, twin screw. Service speed 13 knots. 2,489 passengers (162 first class, 184 second class, 2143 third class). One funnel and four masts. Steel hull, four decks. Crew 250. [...] Built for Hamburg-American Line, German flag, in 1899 and named Patricia. Hamburg-New York service. Laid-up 1914-1919. Transferred to United States Government, American flag, in 1919 and renamed USS Patricia. US Government service. Scrapped in 1921."

• "Why Your Family Name Was Not Changed at Ellis Island (and One That Was)" (this debunks the idea that Ellis Island officials changed immigrants' names)
• Jewish Given Names. This includes a section on the name Alter, a section on Americanization, and a section called "Names on Passenger Lists", which says:

  "It is important to remember that these lists were compiled before the ship landed. Thus these lists contain the European, pre-Americanized names. You will find no Jewish "Jenny"s or "Harry"s among them -- those are American names. For Jews from Eastern Europe, the names used on the passenger manifests will be the secular Yiddish names. The names were written down the way that they sounded, in the phonetics of the language of the ship."

  .